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 Post subject: Level Designs
PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2007 5:20 pm 
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 7:30 pm
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I thought I'd broach this as sort of discussion on level design. I've been trying to get a feel for it, and seeing what varieties I've enjoyed or thought were unique. Many of them are 'shoot the floating ship' or that style; the most interesting that I saw instead messed with the shape by having a ring that rotated variably (and a few 'nodes' traveling that).

What kind of interesting designs have you seen or would like to try? I'm wondering about something mentioned before, a "death star run" using a big ring. Only possible to do if there was text editing though for the moment (too much outside the field of view)

Ah, found the level I was rambling about. This gave me the idea to bring up this topic;

http://zetaflow.skylogic.ca/ZetaFlow.php?ID=3196


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2007 8:44 pm 
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Would you explain more about what the "death star run" would be like?
I got interested when you mentioned text editing :P


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2007 9:23 pm 
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well, one suggestion was that in addition to an editor screen would be a text-only version of the editor (or mode).

I was thinking about levels that are designed much bigger than the screen, and let you 'move' through them by rotating. In this case, a ring with obstacles, guns, barriers, and so on. It's just a thought, but...

edit: more or less, I'm just curious about how people find designs. I think I am liking the thought of simpler designs particularly that seem to 'move' unnaturally. Kind of the thing that makes you lean in the seat to try and straighten out the surroundings. Not sure if that makes sense...


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 07, 2008 10:10 pm 
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trickstapriest wrote:
I was thinking about levels that are designed much bigger than the screen, and let you 'move' through them by rotating. In this case, a ring with obstacles, guns, barriers, and so on.
I've made an attempt at that here, it wasn't as interesting as I had hoped but hopefully it inspires someone to do one better!

By the way, I used Mouzi's generator to make the walls, no way I would do that by hand :D

~MD


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 07, 2008 10:51 pm 
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 7:30 pm
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That's very cool, actually. more or less what I was thinking... as the levels grow more complex though, there is that lag problem that makes it hard to execute. Ah well.

actually, I saw another design that was also very interesting; a rotating boss with various 'equipment'... not all of the pieces would be on each thing, I think. Although that might have been a bug. The concept was interesting though. A boss with four or five 'sides', rotating back and forth between them, and a couple extra weapon pods that spun around to help.

What other kind of level designs have people been pondering/seeing?


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 1:43 am 
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I've been thinking about two that would use rotation pausing:

Mouzi wrote:
Some cool uses for this would be for example a survival level where you have to survive for something like 1-2 minutes and then the level would change. Or then I had an idea about a level with maybe 3 different ships where only one of them is visible and then the visible one would change with certain interval.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 5:21 pm 
Joined: Tue Sep 25, 2007 9:52 am
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trickstapriest wrote:
A boss with four or five 'sides', rotating back and forth between them, and a couple extra weapon pods that spun around to help.

What other kind of level designs have people been pondering/seeing?


Ranouse made one like that: http://zetaflow.skylogic.ca/ZetaFlow.php?ID=1680
Although he did it 'by hand' without the notepad or Mouzi's program.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 10:16 pm 
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That might have been the level I was talking about, actually! I think the whole robot rotated, but I recognize the 'front' shield, weapon pods, and arms. I think it wasn't fully working at the time... yes, that's a very interesting go. I'd love to see how Mouzi will put together something like that.

Right now I'm contemplating the design I used and the possibility of 'tossing' spheres. Simply having it face the player doesn't work, as the spheres will just move as you try and dodge. Making the unit rotate to the player and having it 'stiff' pointing at them could work, but it looks really bad. Anyway, it'd be an interesting weapon-object.

What I'm actually considering as a larger thing is four dancing spheres with small weapon pods that 'hop' on and off screen on intervals. Destroying them opens up the center... But I think that'll lag flash far too much.


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2008 3:24 am 
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trickstapriest wrote:
I'd love to see how Mouzi will put together something like that.


Put together what? o.O


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2008 3:00 pm 
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trickstapriest wrote:
actually, I saw another design that was also very interesting; a rotating boss with various 'equipment'... not all of the pieces would be on each thing, I think. Although that might have been a bug. The concept was interesting though. A boss with four or five 'sides', rotating back and forth between them, and a couple extra weapon pods that spun around to help.


Mouzi wrote:
I've been thinking about two that would use rotation pausing:

Mouzi wrote:
Some cool uses for this would be for example a survival level where you have to survive for something like 1-2 minutes and then the level would change. Or then I had an idea about a level with maybe 3 different ships where only one of them is visible and then the visible one would change with certain interval.


Geiss wrote:
Ranouse made one like that: http://zetaflow.skylogic.ca/ZetaFlow.php?ID=1680
Although he did it 'by hand' without the notepad or Mouzi's program.


trickstapriest wrote:
That might have been the level I was talking about, actually! I think the whole robot rotated, but I recognize the 'front' shield, weapon pods, and arms. I think it wasn't fully working at the time... yes, that's a very interesting go. I'd love to see how Mouzi will put together something like that.


Mouzi wrote:
Put together what? o.O


Put together that... :D the level design we were yammering about that your survival level sounds like... unless you are thinking of something entirely different, which is also possible. A morphing enemy is what I figured you meant, although an environment that changes upon intervals is actually what I've been wondering about lately. Maybe that's what you meant?


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2008 1:23 am 
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I meant that the whole boss would change with certain intervals.
And I won't be putting together anything. They were just ideas.
Here's the rest of the text:

Mouzi wrote:
Some cool uses for this would be for example a survival level where you have to survive for something like 1-2 minutes and then the level would change. Or then I had an idea about a level with maybe 3 different ships where only one of them is visible and then the visible one would change with certain interval :P

Both good ideas IMO and I know how to make them, but I don't have the imagination to create the ships or the survival thing :/
As I've already said I suck on the creative and gameplay side of making levels.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2008 10:27 am 
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I think it's a shame that you cannot base certain weapons' existence/firing ability on what happens earlier in the game. For example, only after you destroy X part or wall or gun embankment, then will the crazy laser barrage blasts at you. That would make the "level-style" bosses feel less stagnant.


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 13, 2008 6:37 pm 
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Point, Mouzi. ;)
Yeah, bosses that 'shift' on intervals would be interesting. I suppose that's vaugely like what I have in mind...

Well, it'd be interesting if there was an 'invisible' tag that you could switch on and off when pieces were destroyed (like you can 'destroy' objects when others die). If it was invisible, you couldn't touch it nor could it shoot or be shot, but it'd be calculated for vector-positioning computation purposes.

Though since that seems to be a big component of the 'stress' on the system, making enemies that aren't visible in the beginning but are visible later may not actually make it easier for the flash game to process... still, it would be an interesting dynamic. a toggle or on/off visibility function. I suppose it's up to MD to see how easy switches on behavior (firing rate) or other things would be, and whether he has time to bother ;)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2008 6:54 am 
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trickstapriest wrote:
What other kind of level designs have people been pondering/seeing?


Now I have two new (at least I think they're new) ideas that I have actually made into levels \o/
Resizing (example) and Ultimate Defence 2
I have no comments about them, so you just have to look for yourself ;)


By the way, has anyone tried my "A puzzle" level?
First I thought that it didn't really work the way I wanted, but today I noticed that it actually works :O
In that level I tried to make a puzzle where you have to move the pieces to complete the level, but it seemed to me like I had messed it up.
Now I have realised that you actually can move it so that you will be able to shoot at it directly.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2008 9:03 am 
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Mouzi - I've beat your "A puzzle" level when you first presented it by moving side-to-side. I just retried it to see if I could do it directly but haven't found the secret.

The resizing level is awesome!

Ultimate Defence 2 was unbeatable for me. I gave up after a few minutes because it seemed that the parts were invincible????

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